Module 2, Week 2 – Gandhi the Movie

Nonviolence Home Forums Book Discussion Metta Certificate Pilot Program Module 2, Week 2 – Gandhi the Movie

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  • #11428

    In this week’s discussion forum, share your general reflections on watching Gandhi the movie. You may want to consider whether you agree with Michael’s assessment of the movie (in the podcast), and also share some of your homework observations.

    #11448
    Erika
    Member

    Watching the movie, “Gandhi”, I noticed some obvious examples of obstructive programme including when he continued the burning of the ID passes for Indians in South Africa, continuing to walk on the sidewalk (along side a ‘white’man) and not step off when those young men insisted, the burning of cloth and clothing made in England, the making of salt at the sea, even his fasts would qualify under this category. Of course, he advocated constructive programme as being more important than obstructive. Some of these instances from the film include the spinning of yarn and making and wearing of homespun garments, making salt (once again), insisting on treating and being treated with dignity ( when he was told that he had been warned, his reply was that the other had also been warned) and when he insisted that a place at the table be set for Mr. Walker’s driver. Many of Gandhi’s words in the film were examples of heart unity and being exhorted to be engaged in it. He called for Hindu-Muslim unity, to remove “untouchability from our hearts and our lives”. He recalled when he was younger that the religious leader he followed “moved from the Hindu Gita to the Muslim Koran as if it didn’t matter which book was being read as long as God was being worshipped”. Again he said, “I am a Muslim, a Hindu, a Jew and a Christian and so are all of you” as he was being driven away in the car from his ashram. Even his fast was a show of heart unity since he undertook one of them to show penance for the murder of the policemen during the Hindu-Muslim rioting. The most striking example to me of satyagraha (“truth force”) was when he was giving that first speech to a gathering in the auditorium and spoke about how they would attack no one…how they cannot take away their self respect unless they give it to them…how their pain will make the oppressors see the injustice of their actions…and finally how if they kill him “they will have my dead body, but not my obedience”. Very powerful words exploding with the truth. That speech always raises the hair on my arms!

    Watching this film is always a powerful experience for me. Attenborough selected some of the most salient events in Gandhi’s long, influential life. I am grateful for this
    creative “snapshot”, because who could ever document all of the important things in this man’s life?
    Jean

    #11457
    Erika
    Member

    I have watched the movie “Gandhi” numerous times before but each time I leave inspired. It must have been so hard to figure out what parts of Gandhi’s life to put in a movie but I think a decent job was done. I feel it is a pretty outstanding movie.

    One of my favorite moments of the movie is when Gandhi and some other members of what I believe is the Indian Congress are sitting around with British representatives. One of the British representatives says something like “You don’t expect us to just leave do you” and Gandhi replies in a confident and strong “Yes” and then states that 100,000 Englishmen cannot control 350 million Indians if they refuse to cooperative. I have always found the truth and force of this statement very powerful. It is very similar to a finding by Tolstoy in a “Letter to a Hindu” which was written to an Indian who I believe supported violent means of overthrowing the British. The letter was later obtained and published by Gandhi. Tolstoy states,

    “A commercial company enslaved a nation comprising two hundred millions. Tell this to a man free from superstition and he will fail to grasp what these words mean. What does it mean that thirty thousand men, not athletes but rather weak and ordinary people, have subdued two hundred million vigorous, clever, capable, and freedom-loving people? Do not the figures make it clear that it is not the English who have enslaved the Indians, but the Indians who have enslaved themselves?”

    While on the subject of Tolstoy I have found it surprising that both Michael Nagler and Sri Eknath Easwaran, both who I have a great deal of respect and appreciation for, hardly ever mention Tolstoy and the effect his life and works had on Gandhi. Gandhi even named his ashram after him his effect was so great yet both hardly ever mention his influence or allude to his works and I personally feel this is a loss to both of their great efforts.

    Another aspect of the movie that stuck out this time was that even though both Hindu’s and Muslims practiced non-violence on a scale that has not ever really ever been seen in history before, the civil war that erupted during the partition was obviously a departure from this stance. It makes one wonder how much of what was practiced was as Professor Nagler would say principled non-violence vs. strategic non-violence. If some of the descent into violence was because the non-violence was accepted for strategic reason as opposed to being accepted at the heart and moral level than the possible future dangers for a struggle that is engaging in non-violence for only practical reasons seem evident. If a movement is non-violent but allows the possibility of violence in a different future conflict it is possible that even a skilled practitioner of non-violence may find themselves switching to violence if they think that will achieve the end better. It reminds me of switching to a particular diet, such as a vegetarian one, for health instead of moral reasons. While both can be positive it is probably more likely that a person that was switching to such a diet for health rather the moral reasons may go back to eating meat if there is the possibility of getting similar or better (at least on the surface) health benefits.

    Another aspect that stuck out was the training and discipline necessary to engage in non-violence. Without that training and discipline staying true to such actions seems increasingly difficult. As a country I think we are undisciplined in so many ways, particularly with the countless unnecessary desires we have accumulated thanks in part by our societal setup that it will be rather challenging to do the internal work that will lead us to effective external actions. It makes me even more appreciative of the work we discussed in the first module to try and help us with the practices and habits which are so essential to becoming capable of these great but challenging goals, internal and external, that we are attempting to obtain.

    Also below is the link to the Tolstoy letter which is one of the best and convincing writing on non-violence I have seen for anyone interested

    http://www.nonresistance.org/docs_pdf/Tolstoy/Correspondence_with_Gandhi.pdf

    #11458
    Erika
    Member

    Seeing the movie about Gandhi’s life for the first time was incredibly powerful, moving, and uplifting; to see someone with such a profound sense and commitment to truth and nonviolence and to know that this man existed and carried out his actions and words is encouraging and beautiful for me. As I was sitting watching the movie, I started thinking how incredibly blessed I feel to have the chance to learn from such a man, to be in this program, and to be on my nonviolence journey. There were many quotes from the movie that stuck with me, here are a few (Sorry if I misquoted some!):
    -“Enemy strikes you on the right cheek, offer the left”
    -“I am prepared to die, not prepared to kill or attack anyone.” -Gandhi
    -“They can torture my body, break my bones and they will have my broken dead body, but they will not have my obedience.” -Gandhi
    “Terrorism would only justify repression.” -Gandhi
    -“Change their minds, not kill them for the weakness we all possess” -Gandhi
    – They day of prayer and fasting on the anniversary of the massacre; shut down the city since all were civil workers
    -“England has power, army, navy, weapons but when a great power like that strikes defenseless people, it shows their brutality, its own weakness, especially when those people don’t strike back.”
    -“If we riot, if we fight back, we become vandals, and they become the law; but if they strike, they become the vandals and we become the law.”
    -“Violence creates an excuse for more injustice laws.” -Gandhi
    -“If we obtain freedom by bloodshed and murder, I want no part of that.”-Gandhi

    #11461

    I’m glad to hear that you all benefited from watching the movie, whether you were watching it again or if it was the first time! Indeed, reading your comments I felt like I was watching it yet again. Jean, you did a great job of summarizing the different instances of constructive programme, obstructive programme and heart unity. It’s interesting to see what you all pulled from the film and took away, and as both John and Jean noted, it’s hard to imagine how difficult it would have been to choose the moments of Gandhi’s life to show!

    John, you bring up an interesting point about Tolstoy – thank you for addressing that, and thank you for sharing the letter! I will have to ask Michael about the omission.

    Marissa – great list of Gandhi quotes! I find it’s really helpful to be able to quote Gandhi offhand. There’s rarely a moment in life when something he said doesn’t have striking relevance, and a lesson to teach us!

    You also mentioned how blessed we are to be able to learn from him – and we will continue to do so, especially in the coming weeks as we explore Gandhi the Man and the podcast series. In fact, in one of the podcasts this upcoming week, Michael talks about how we don’t need “another Gandhi,” because we haven’t fully learned from the first one! 🙂

    Thank you all for your sharing! His life really was his message, wasn’t it?
    Stephanie

    #11489
    Erika
    Member

    Hello! This was my second time watching this movie, but now that I’ve learned more about Gandhi’s life, I definitely picked up some “nonviolence moments’ in the film. It is a powerful presentation of his life and commitment, and I appreciate that such a resource is there for us to enjoy.

    Having read about half of the book “Gandhi the Man,” I do agree with Prof. Nagler that the movie has some limitations. Like he said, just by watching the movie people would not know where his ideas came from, his spiritual foundation. Also, it would have been nice to show that inner transformation he had to go through himself from being an unsuccessful lawyer to Mahatma. Of course, one film cannot cover everything – but it is easy to just see Gandhi as saint or someone so far away from each one of us if we just see his perfections.

    One thing that I think the movie did do somewhat of a good job was how he was able to impact his “opponents” – police, those in favor of using violence against Muslims etc through his integrity and character. Another aspect that I liked was the description of deep relationships he had with his closest supporters, especially Nehru. The bonds between them, and how Nehru adored Gandhi and wanted to put Gandhi’s mind at peace was really touching.

    Like John said, I am also thinking how the “success” of Gandhi’s efforts can be evaluated given the civil conflict that was brought out after the separation of India and Pakistan. Perhaps in light of bringing independence from the British it was a success, and both Hindus and Muslims had a common goal in that regard, which would have facilitated the success. The issue became when their interests were at conflict. People may have stopped using violence when Gandhi fasted, but maybe for some it was just because they cared about Gandhi (behavior only) and not because they truly changed the they viewed each other. I also wonder if the relationships between two parties also impacted people’s use of violence (i.e. India was oppressed by the British ruling, while after independence India and Pakistan were in a sense at equal standing).

    On a side note, I came across with this posting: http://www.smileosmile.com/celebrities/why-i-killed-gandhi-nathuram-godses-final-address-to-the-court/. Not sure how accurate this is, but if this was true statement made by Godse, it is very interesting. At the least, I can see that in his eyes Gandhi looked as a threat to his nation’s best interest. Thought I’d share.

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